Unlimited P2P

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tocpcs
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Post by tocpcs » Thu Aug 30, 2007 3:15 pm

thomashouseman wrote:
ForumAdmin wrote:
DarkLotus wrote:So given the current information, how much would we be looking at for a 8mbps plan, that allowed say 100-150gb of P2P downloads, along with 12-24gb of normal data?
In the event that the caching service was used as an 'add on' to current plans (in other words the current peak and of peak allowances and month price of the current plan stayed as it is now) I would think that the data sourced from the cache would be around 20 cents per gbyte.

So you would get a plan with:

12 gb peak
40 gb off peak
50 gb cache any time of day

total 102 gb

for your current plan price plus $10.00.
This is the best explanation yet and cleared up my speculation.
I agree! :) That's adding a lot more value to the plans!

tocpcs
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Post by tocpcs » Thu Aug 30, 2007 3:18 pm

ForumAdmin wrote:
tocpcs wrote:
ForumAdmin wrote: The cost would be $130.00 if someone wanted to download 300 gb per month on a 1500/256 connection.

It was an example.
1) You are referring to Exetel's costs?

2) Perhaps you can stop posting confusing responses, and give us a complete post that details what exactly is on offer and being discussed here?


3) Can a user on a 1500, $75.00 plan, pay $85 and download 300GB of cached P2P data?

4) Or perhaps clarify your wording of unlimted, and a few possible user scenarios ? That might help!
1) No - the cost to the end user of such a plan should it ever exist.

2) I can stop posting on this topic completely if that would be of assistance to you.

3) No.

4) It's too late for me to learn how to write in any different manner than I do.
3) No one was suggesting that, I was simply saying that many responses from you have left users confused and speculation increased.

I was suggesting perhaps you give an example as you did in the post before the quoted reply.

102GB for $85 @ 8Mb !

gong_guy
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Post by gong_guy » Thu Aug 30, 2007 3:30 pm

thomashouseman wrote:
ForumAdmin wrote:
So you would get a plan with:

12 gb peak
40 gb off peak
50 gb cache any time of day

total 102 gb

for your current plan price plus $10.00.
This is the best explanation yet and cleared up my speculation.
The problem I see is how does a person know what his cache hit rate will be?

Popular torrents will score very high, older or less popular torrents may not hit the cache at all.

You would have to check your usage often to avoid overshooting and getting an excess charge.

Same with USENET, Exetel's cache would be puny compared to even USENETs daily volume of 4TB+++

Not being critical, just I see issues.

DarkLotus
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Post by DarkLotus » Thu Aug 30, 2007 3:32 pm

thanks. that really helped to clear things up, I was rather confused about the situation before, pretty sure others were as well.


It sounds like great end user value, especially if we can still use the offpeak data for P2P downloads.

One last question though.
Say i start downloading an uncached torrent, does this go towards my data limit, or towards my P2Pcache limit?

If it goes towards my data limit, will we be able to determine in some way if data is cached or not.

ForumAdmin
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Post by ForumAdmin » Thu Aug 30, 2007 5:39 pm

DarkLotus wrote:thanks. that really helped to clear things up, I was rather confused about the situation before, pretty sure others were as well.


It sounds like great end user value, especially if we can still use the offpeak data for P2P downloads.

One last question though.
Say i start downloading an uncached torrent, does this go towards my data limit, or towards my P2Pcache limit?

If it goes towards my data limit, will we be able to determine in some way if data is cached or not.
I don't know yet.

ForumAdmin
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Post by ForumAdmin » Thu Aug 30, 2007 5:51 pm

gong_guy wrote: This is the best explanation yet and cleared up my speculation.

The problem I see is how does a person know what his cache hit rate will be?

Popular torrents will score very high, older or less popular torrents may not hit the cache at all.

You would have to check your usage often to avoid overshooting and getting an excess charge.

Same with USENET, Exetel's cache would be puny compared to even USENETs daily volume of 4TB+++

Not being critical, just I see issues.
We've been looking at these solutions for some 15 months and know how to deal with/address the issues you raise.
Last edited by ForumAdmin on Fri Aug 31, 2007 8:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

deed

Post by deed » Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:43 pm

Well what we need now is a way to figure out how to enable it, im more then willing to try it out.

dogwomble
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Post by dogwomble » Fri Aug 31, 2007 7:55 am

Viss wrote:grow up exetel and stop being greedy your becomming another Helstra.
Another case of somebody expecting too much from nothing.

I would expect that if I were using infrastructure that Exetel had to spend a lot of money in implementing, I would have to pay for it to establish a worthwhile ROI for Exetel.

I am in support of the $10 a month charge. I may or may not use it, after all I've just gone to ADSL2+ and have noticed since moving from ADSL1 a significant improvement in P2P (and I don't use it as much any more). However, if I do decide to use it, I'd be happy to pay the extra $10 a month - after all, if the claims from Exetel that it's gonna cost half a million dollars are true, they've got to get their money back from somewhere and $10 isn't really _that_ much!

dogwomble
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Post by dogwomble » Fri Aug 31, 2007 7:57 am

Macko wrote:
Hi Macko,

Download scheduler?

James

If we're talking P2P, you can't schedule something you need to find first and download. Normal downloads & updates I can do between midnight and noon.

Macko
Actually, the download scheduler is a good point. I use uTorrent as my client, and that allows me to set up two different "time zones" if you will. One where it runs at "full speed", and one where I can restrict the bandwidth. I just set it to run at a slower speed during peak time to avoid going over.

However, as has been previously stated, there would be no changes to current plans - so if you're otherwise happy with the one you're on, there's no absolute _need_ to change to the higher priced one if $10 a month is difficult for you.

Viss
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Post by Viss » Fri Aug 31, 2007 10:23 am

dogwomble wrote:
Viss wrote:grow up exetel and stop being greedy your becomming another Helstra.
Another case of somebody expecting too much from nothing.

I would expect that if I were using infrastructure that Exetel had to spend a lot of money in implementing, I would have to pay for it to establish a worthwhile ROI for Exetel.

I am in support of the $10 a month charge. I may or may not use it, after all I've just gone to ADSL2+ and have noticed since moving from ADSL1 a significant improvement in P2P (and I don't use it as much any more). However, if I do decide to use it, I'd be happy to pay the extra $10 a month - after all, if the claims from Exetel that it's gonna cost half a million dollars are true, they've got to get their money back from somewhere and $10 isn't really _that_ much!
You have missed the whole point of my post I pay for an internet service for which I pay 80 p/m, I pay for the fastest I can get from Exetel. I would be expecting to be able to download my my quota of downloads from where ever it may be to the tune of 8gb or what ever i have to use without having my speed throttled because im using a torrent. I find this behavoir poor and I expected more from Exetel. Its another ploy to up the fee and make more money from you. You can go to any other ISP and not have any part of your speed throttled just because you download a torrent.

And part B of my arguement is an email I received from Exetel about the use of torrent files, and downloading illegal content. Yes ok there is free content out there but this really promotes people to download non legal torrents because they can and they will. Exetel will boot your ass as quick as look at you as soon as they receive notification that you have been downloading illegal torrent files, and if you say that this wont happen your a joker mate because while illegal torrents exist people will download them.

I was wondering why my WoW updates were taking so long and now I know. I have been with Exetel for 2 years now and have bought atleast 8 new customers, up untill now I have put up with the Ohh your plan no longer exists crap you now have to pay $5 more and we will give you 10 less gb this has happend to me 6 times in the past 2 years when I first joined exetel I was paying $55 pm with 32gb download now I pay $80.00 and get 8 gb ????? yeh strange and now sting me another $10.00 so I can use my internet at full speed to get my WoW updates, What a joke can you see why im pissed off ?

Anyway when I move house I will be taking my business elsewhere and I will not be recommending exetel any longer.

James
Exetel Staff
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Post by James » Fri Aug 31, 2007 10:56 am

Hi Viss,

Almost all Australian ISPs now admit to deprioritizing p2p/torrent traffic.

If you read the thread carefully you would see the $10 fee does not relate to your download allowance at all, but provides 40-50 gigabytes of extra traffic.

James

ForumAdmin
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Post by ForumAdmin » Fri Aug 31, 2007 11:03 am

Viss wrote:
1) I would be expecting to be able to download my my quota of downloads from where ever it may be to the tune of 8gb or what ever i have to use without having my speed throttled because im using a torrent. I find this behavoir poor and I expected more from Exetel.

2)Its another ploy to up the fee and make more money from you.

3) You can go to any other ISP and not have any part of your speed throttled just because you download a torrent.
.
1) Your "torrent speeds" are as fast as its possible for you to get for the overwhelming majority of time you choose to download them.

2) No it isn't - its a way of making additional P2P downloads (over and above what is already included in any plan) available at around 20 cents per gb.

3) No you can't - there is not one ISP in Australia of any size that doesn't use some form of control on the bandwidth available to P2P traffic.

The only difference is that Exetel makes no secret of it and also provides 12 hours of every day where downloads aren't counted so that you can dowwnload more than any other ISP in Australia makes available to you at much lower prices.

If you truly believe that providing you with 40 gb of downloads at no charge is somehow not in your best interests then I wish you luck in getting a better service for your P2P downloads.

Spanner_Man

Re: What do users download using P2P and from what service?

Post by Spanner_Man » Fri Aug 31, 2007 6:12 pm

skurlow wrote:I would hate to see exetel get prosecuted for catering directly for the P2P market when it most probably is simply supporting piracy!
There is already American ISP's in place that have special plans for different uses.
Eg. Lower priced plans for users who just email/webbrowse/basic internet access
Higher cost plans for users who want p2p access/newsgroups/streaming

So if anything those ISPs in American will be target first by music companys and so forth

gong_guy
Posts: 210
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Post by gong_guy » Fri Aug 31, 2007 7:48 pm

ForumAdmin wrote: So you would get a plan with:

12 gb peak
40 gb off peak
50 gb cache any time of day

total 102 gb

for your current plan price plus $10.00.
Forumadmin how about this ! Just an idea to throw against the wall.

Why not guarantee the first 50GB of P2P to be free and not counted to the quota for say $5 more at $15?

So you would get a plan with:

12 gb peak
40 gb off peak
First 50 gb of P2P any time of day free

total 102 gb

for your current plan price plus $15.00.


You take the risk of not hitting the cache, you can identify P2P traffic. people may be more comfortable with that and if your cache is as good as you say it is you will be in front.

Again just a idea

tocpcs
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Post by tocpcs » Fri Aug 31, 2007 8:05 pm

gong_guy wrote:
ForumAdmin wrote: So you would get a plan with:

12 gb peak
40 gb off peak
50 gb cache any time of day

total 102 gb

for your current plan price plus $10.00.
Forumadmin how about this ! Just an idea to throw against the wall.

Why not guarantee the first 50GB of P2P to be free and not counted to the quota for say $5 more at $15?

So you would get a plan with:

12 gb peak
40 gb off peak
First 50 gb of P2P any time of day free

total 102 gb

for your current plan price plus $15.00.


You take the risk of not hitting the cache, you can identify P2P traffic. people may be more comfortable with that and if your cache is as good as you say it is you will be in front.

Again just a idea
That's what ForumAdmin said earlier, except a $10 price tag attached to it, and not a $15..

"Why pay more?".

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