Saving The Gouldian Finch?

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ForumAdmin
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Location: Sydney

Post by ForumAdmin » Thu Dec 13, 2007 5:34 pm

mis42n wrote:Not happy Jan.

There was a time when you went to a grocery store for groceries
to a petrol station for petrol
to a tool store for tools
to an ISP for an internet connection

Now grocery stores give you petrol discounts
petrol stations give you flybys
tool stores give you 'free' tickets in a car raffle
one ISP wants to be a charity

Wouldn't it be nice if when we tried to purchase something, that's all we paid for. That would give us discretionary dollars to spend on other things that we wanted to happen.

I have no problem being asked to donate. Exetel can send me all the begging letters it wants. But give me the right to choose. I think the finch is doing OK thank you, as a domestic pet. I don't want to support it. I'm sure there are more distressed species than the finch, that are not domesticated and therefore will be extinct not just in the wild but totally. Maybe I'll support them.
The point is that you can't donate 50 cents a month to charities - it isn't financially viable.

Or have you never put your small change at your local store into their collection 'tin'? They then tally it up and send a cheque to the charity.

The same as this concept - Exetel simply makes one very large payment made up from tens of thousands of very small payments.
Last edited by ForumAdmin on Fri Dec 14, 2007 12:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Munka
Posts: 289
Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2005 8:22 pm
Location: Rural NSW

Post by Munka » Thu Dec 13, 2007 5:58 pm

The truth is I do love the small birds be it the Gouldian finch Zebra finch, the orange bellied parrot, even the Blue Wrens, all these species are under pressure, most of it man made. And I believe their gradual demise is significant, in many many ways.

There where some comments regarding the ones kept in aviaries, and I think that comment is a very telling point, Do internet users leave the city to adventure into the true interior? I don't mean getting out to the Hunter Valley to do the wine adventures.

The other truth is this particular species may not have been my first choice to focus on. But that is irrelevant to the point.

And I applaud Exetels initiative, and will happily pledge monthly donations. And find myself a little disappointed at some of the mean spirited attitudes shown in this thread.

But perhaps I just dont get out much.
Munka

ChristianG
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Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2005 6:11 pm

Post by ChristianG » Thu Dec 13, 2007 6:11 pm

ForumAdmin wrote: Or have you never put your small change at your local store into their collection 'tin'? They then taly it up and send a cheque to the charity.
totally correct.

they don't automatically add 50 cents to your grocery bill.

Country Bumkin
Posts: 52
Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2007 4:50 pm
Location: Regional QLD

A Greener Exetel

Post by Country Bumkin » Thu Dec 13, 2007 7:02 pm

Some thoughts on a green Exetel...

(1) Get your own house in order, the most obvious is green power. Choose a plan from http://www.greenelectricitywatch.org.au//index.php

(2) Other practical conservation suggestions for the company and staff could come from the Alternative Technology Association http://ata.org.au/

(3) Raise some cash by letting customers choose from 3 different off-peak quotas, those choosing smaller quotas add more cash to an enviro fund.

(4) Allow customers to add an optional amount of cash to the fund.

(5) There are plenty of green things for the fund to save on this list. http://www.environment.gov.au/tax/reo/index.html

Regards C Bumkin - off the grid and off my rocker.

pjb42
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Location: Victoria

Post by pjb42 » Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:53 pm

Hi all,

I'm a member of Amnesty International and I was donating a sizable sum monthly, I also donated to other charities as/when I could (not lately as I am on medical leave for some months).

I would need to talk to my house-mate about this as she pays half the bill. :) But generally, I like it. I would prefer opt-in option in the members area. You could set a minimum monthly donation (say $1) up to whatever a member feels like donating. Remember that life for many people is not very stable at present, and while they may be able to donate a small sum regularly, now and then they may be able to kick in more, or have to opt-out temporarily. The customer should always have the option. Given that you would have to administer the process, you would have to do your own cost-benefit-risk analysis also. :)

A reminder by mail or as part of the eMail newsletter would be a good idea. Most people have good intentions, but need a gentle reminder when life is hectic! :) The sad fact right now is that many people are more worried about their grocery bill let alone donating to save endangered wildlife, or other good causes. Not because they don't care, but because they can't afford to.

I would also love to see something like a petition (for example) to the new Rudd Government to get them to match Exetel Customer donations dollar for dollar (or something like that). I think that might get more people interested, and help out the Wildlife Fund (or whatever charity Exetel & members want to support next). It would be a good way to build an "Exetel Community" :) You could create a forum area for that kind of "Exetel Community Advocacy". Exetel have a large enough membership for that to be feasible.

Hope this helps. :)

BTW, I applaud your initiative in this. :) The fact that your intention is to donate a part of what the customer pays for their service (which means that it's coming out of your pocket as it were, and will be a significant amount), and have an option for the customers to contribute something as well, is a good example of a Commercial/Consumer joint venture. :) I am sure there are many members that would rather you donate the 50c (or whatever) to them (by way of a discount), but if 50c or even $1/mth for the Internet/phone bill is a big problem, they have some serious other problems to look at. I'm currently on a disability pension, which is peanuts compared to what I was making, and I don't mind the idea at all.

It's kinda nice to know I chose an ISP with a conscience and that gives a damn. I could have gone to Telstra, could anyone see them doing something like this?? Sure! After they jacked the prices up $5/Mth, they'd be happy to be good corporate citizens and donate 50c a Mth/customer! It's all the ACCC's fault you see! LMAO

/sarchasm

Cheers!
Last edited by pjb42 on Thu Dec 13, 2007 9:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

jamiep
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Location: QLD

Post by jamiep » Thu Dec 13, 2007 9:09 pm

I would never donate to the WWF as they don't oppose trophy hunting
http://www.panda.org.za/article.php?id=393

There are plenty of good organisations out there such as Sea Shepard.. that are real conservations and not just trying to keep species availiable so they can be a resource for humans.

People may object to natural habitats being destroyed but who objects to the root why they are being destroyed?

Munka
Posts: 289
Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2005 8:22 pm
Location: Rural NSW

Post by Munka » Thu Dec 13, 2007 9:26 pm

jamiep wrote: There are plenty of good organisations out there such as Sea Shepard.. that are real conservations and not just trying to keep species availiable so they can be a resource for humans.
I agree with you and also support sea shepherd, and also EarthFirst, though they are self confessed monkey wrenches (look it up) who forgo non violent direct action in favor of more aggressive means, so unfortunately you just lost the support
of much of the population.
Munka

ForumAdmin
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Location: Sydney

Post by ForumAdmin » Thu Dec 13, 2007 9:57 pm

jamiep wrote:I would never donate to the WWF as they don't oppose trophy hunting
http://www.panda.org.za/article.php?id=393

There are plenty of good organisations out there such as Sea Shepard.. that are real conservations and not just trying to keep species availiable so they can be a resource for humans.

People may object to natural habitats being destroyed but who objects to the root why they are being destroyed?
Well - we won't be donating to WWF (Australia) as they tell me that Telstra won't allow them to accept money/support from companies Telstra compete with (for goodness sake - Exetel as a competitor to Telstra!!).

Sea Shepherd is a US organisation as far as I know.

If you know any reputable Australian organisations who might be running programs to assist these:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Threatened ... _Australia

then I would be grateful for any information anyone is able to give.

wheelo
Posts: 9
Joined: Fri Sep 29, 2006 6:43 pm

Post by wheelo » Thu Dec 13, 2007 10:11 pm

AndrewDunn wrote:I'd rather my money went to research for renewable energy or a starving kid in an african country.
Didn't we start throwing money at starving African children after band aid in 1984? Has it helped? These people would not be over populating unsustainable areas of Africa if westerners stopped throwing money at them. Until African governments have the ability to teach their population about contraception, throwing money at starving Africans creates perpetual misery.

IMHO , buying free trade products from African farms and businesses benefts Africa a whole lot more.

HeyBuddy
Posts: 2
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Location: Sydney

Post by HeyBuddy » Thu Dec 13, 2007 10:39 pm

I would like to apologize for some of my harsh comments on page 5 they were not called for and i took things a bit too personally and what i have experienced with people and their illness's wasn't called for here and to all the people who want to save the fauna's and finch's i hope you succeed in what you believe is the right thing to do.
Personally i would rather donate a little each month to a cancer research fund
to find a cure sooner but different things touch people differently and i respect that.

austdata
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Location: Melbourne

Post by austdata » Thu Dec 13, 2007 11:32 pm

Bundy wrote:Exetel will not receive any tax reduction from the fruition of this idea except from donations which come out of its own pocket. There will therefore be no 'after-tax surplus' to put into anything.

Just to clarify, if revenue is increased by $xx through customers remaining in the scheme and all of that $xx is donated to a 'deductible gift recipient', then Exetel's taxable profit (and therefore tax payable) will have increased/decreased by exactly $0. Anything they add to the $xx they have collected will be coming straight from the pockets of Exetels shareholders and any tax reduction resulting from this should remain in those same pockets (just like everyone else who claims tax deductions for donations).
I didn't considering the customer donation being committed to either Exetel cost or revenue centres. I saw Exetel acting as a donation collector for amounts less than $2.00. I'm unclear weather Exetel "re-donating" this money would constitute an additional tax deductible sum (if profits exceed said level).

I'm absolutely sure Exetel's normal accounting procedures would account for this additional tax revenue (wow, that's straining my brain - I think it's like discount credit revenue but with tax). I just thought some disclose may pre-empt customer questions after tax time trips to accountants.

Cheers,

Mike

williamthebold
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Location: Australia

Post by williamthebold » Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:41 am

I think it inappropriate for exetel to canvass the exetel client base on matters that are not directly related to the provision of internet services.
Should they do this externally, in the public arena, that would be a different matter.
This present endeavour is bad business practice.

flak
Posts: 153
Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 7:17 am

Post by flak » Fri Dec 14, 2007 4:36 am

Warning, extremely cynical comment coming...
wheelo wrote:Didn't we start throwing money at starving African children after band aid in 1984? Has it helped? These people would not be over populating unsustainable areas of Africa if westerners stopped throwing money at them. Until African governments have the ability to teach their population about contraception, throwing money at starving Africans creates perpetual misery.
With anecdotal evidence suggesting the HIV infection rate is 25% of the population in South Africa, perhaps contraception (barrier) is not the best method of population control in Africa.

You cannot drive for 10 minutes in Johannesburg without seeing a billboard about HIV awareness or hearing a radio advert on the subject. The building in which I am currently working has HIV counselling notices everywhere and the toilets have free condoms.

As an indicator of why the infection rate is so high, the health minister even suggested that HIV can be cured through a course of garlic and ginger.

It appears that the issues that lead to overpopulation in Africa, may in fact be the main factor in controlling population.

jamiep
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2007 5:27 pm
Location: QLD

Root cause?

Post by jamiep » Fri Dec 14, 2007 7:57 am

Has anyone thought to ask why most of Australia has been cleared?

With the human population forever doubling has anyone wondered what is going to happen to remaining forests if we keep farming the same way?

Does anyone know the biggest cause of greenhouse gas?

Does anyone know which Aus industry uses the most water?

Does anyone know a solution that solves the above 4 problems without costing me a cent?

ForumAdmin
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Post by ForumAdmin » Fri Dec 14, 2007 7:59 am

williamthebold wrote:
1) I think it inappropriate for exetel to canvass the exetel client base on matters that are not directly related to the provision of internet services.

2) Should they do this externally, in the public arena, that would be a different matter.

3) This present endeavour is bad business practice.
1) As one consideration was to raise the monthly cost of all services by a small amount the subject is directly related to the provision of internet services.

2) If no advice was sent to the nominated email contract address prior to any change being made then Exetel would breach its own terms of supply and God knows how many people would lodge complaints - my guess would be several thousand.

3) I, personally, don't see how asking people who would be affected (even if it was just a change to the format of their invoice to comply with the legal and taxation ramifications of splitting out the amount charged differently) for their thoughts on such a change can be considered as bad business practice.

However there is little doubt that Exetel is a company that continually involves itself in bad business practices as we have, several times, been advised by our auditors:

a) We charge far too little for our services.

b) We provide far more than is required in delivering our services.

c) We consult and listen to our customers before making most decisions.

d) We actually ask for and read requests from our customers that add value or convenience to the services we already provide and then, often, expend money and resources improving aspects of our services that aren't necessary as the customers already pay for the services in their unenhanced states.

e) Our senior managment waste far too much time exchanging views with our customers instead of more appropriately spending that time thinking up new ways to increase prices and go on long overseas "business development trips".

So you are quite right in accusing Exetel's lazy and inept directors of running a business based on "bad business practices" - perhaps we should more closely study the ways an industry leader such as Telstra operates next time we review the pricing and content of the services we offer - I'm fairly sure that Telstra doesn't run its business as badly as Exetel does.

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