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Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 3:30 pm
by craigj
I'm on an older Naked plan (NONPHONE Z). Will I have option to choose shapping to 512k speed if limit is exceeded? Also, what is the upload speed if download is 512? Thanks.

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 3:37 pm
by cruncher
TerryP wrote:
Netmage wrote:Can VOIP be port prioritsed out of the shapping limit?
Would there be any point to that if shaped to 512k? Normally for voip you are constrained by your upload speed anyway so the difference is hardly anything.
Shaper must be able to recognise VoIP packets and allow them to pass while shaping all other data, otherwise your VoIP packets will be randomly discarded together with the shaped data that overflows the shaping buffer. G711/729 codecs have very low tolerance to packet loss (less than 1%), and even losing few packets here and there will be very noticeable. So yes, this is very a important issue and one of the basics of VoIP network design.

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 3:40 pm
by TerryP
malcolm wrote:
TerryP wrote:
Netmage wrote:Can VOIP be port prioritsed out of the shapping limit?
Would there be any point to that if shaped to 512k? Normally for voip you are constrained by your upload speed anyway so the difference is hardly anything.
This is a fairly important consideration if you want to use Exetel for your telephone services.
I don't see how. Your upload speed is your normal limiting factor for voip. It's not like anything in excess of 800k (or whatever your upload sync is) actually matters.

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 3:46 pm
by TerryP
cruncher wrote:
TerryP wrote:
Netmage wrote:Can VOIP be port prioritsed out of the shapping limit?
Would there be any point to that if shaped to 512k? Normally for voip you are constrained by your upload speed anyway so the difference is hardly anything.
Shaper must be able to recognise VoIP packets and allow them to pass while shaping all other data, otherwise your VoIP packets will be randomly discarded together with the shaped data that overflows the shaping buffer. G711/729 codecs have very low tolerance to packet loss (less than 1%), and even losing few packets here and there will be very noticeable. So yes, this is very a important issue and one of the basics of VoIP network design.
OK fine, I have used voip successfully with a previous ISP when shaped to 64k so would have thought 512k ample.

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 3:54 pm
by fredpauling
Exetel used to consult its loyal customer base before making changes of this sort, and would typically provide a reasonable explanation for wanting to impose the changes. If you had bothered to ask before retrospectively applying these changes without notice, you would have been prepared with a mechanism in place for this of us who really don't want to be shaped. Why have you failed to provide your usually high level of customer service in this instance? :shock:

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 3:56 pm
by cruncher
TerryP wrote: OK fine, I have used voip successfully with a previous ISP when shaped to 64k so would have thought 512k ample.
You are right, 512k is ample - if there is nothing else on the line and ISP shaper is not active. But consider when you download 2mpbs of data traffic while shaped to 512kbps - shaper will randomly discard 1.5mbps (75% in this case) and allow the rest through (25%). Now imagine that you make a VoIP call - single G711 call uses roughly 80kbps of bandwidth (in both directions), which will be mixed into your overall traffic. Since shaper discards 75% of packets that you are trying to download - it will do the same with your VoiP traffic unless it is able to recognise it and allow to pass through. But again, this should not happen in a properly engineered VoIP network, so regular users should not be concerned unless there is a problem.

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:11 pm
by ForumAdmin
fredpauling wrote:Exetel used to consult its loyal customer base before making changes of this sort, and would typically provide a reasonable explanation for wanting to impose the changes. If you had bothered to ask before retrospectively applying these changes without notice, you would have been prepared with a mechanism in place for this of us who really don't want to be shaped. Why have you failed to provide your usually high level of customer service in this instance? :shock:
These changes only affect the latest released ADSL2 plans - some 1,000 customers.

All other ADSL2 plans remain the same....ADSL1 plans aren't affected either.

As the increased allowances would, we would have thought, easily cover the small over usage that we saw when we averaged all of these plans on current usage there seemed to be no problem.

However we will add a function where "shaped" is the default and any customer can choose to be "unshaped" and pay for excess usage just as they do today.

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:13 pm
by ForumAdmin
craigj wrote:I'm on an older Naked plan (NONPHONE Z). Will I have option to choose shapping to 512k speed if limit is exceeded? Also, what is the upload speed if download is 512? Thanks.
No

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:32 pm
by phar4oh
So the online plans are getting a top up hey?

I think it's not fair that I'm on the NF/22INCTEL plan, which is basically the same as the Z/21INCTEL plan but costs me $10 to jump on it.

my plan has an extra 6GB peak, but costs an extra $5 p/mth (which is still more expensive than paying 50c/GB). If this plan is going to get even more peak than mine then that's going to feel like a kick in the pants.

So...copy and paste my plan, set offpeak allowance to unlimited, lower the montly cost, increase the peak allowance then charge me $10 to use it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: C'MOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN!

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:36 pm
by igor
I need full speed and I'm happy to pay for the excess data. Shaping sucks!

BTW, why does this forum dies every 5 minutes?! You offer no phone support and your support forum is dead most of the time!

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:48 pm
by danioj
igor wrote:
BTW, why does this forum dies every 5 minutes?! You offer no phone support and your support forum is dead most of the time!
Not for me. From either my work connection or from my Exetel connection from home. Although I would reasonably expect a forum DB to struggle if it gets hammered @ peak times (e.g. when they release details of a new / change in service which impacts ALL Exetel users in some way).

All the guys are usually available on IRC too! irc.exetel.com.au.

But thanks for the response earlier ForumAdmin. Nice increased quota to my plan more allowance than I can use and still a cool $60! :D

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:57 pm
by James
supercheap wrote:"2) All plans will be changed from having an excess charge if a user exceeds their peak period allowance to shaping to 512 kbps down"

I am on the old INC2SLA plan, with shaping of 2 Gb extra of free allowance, and an excess charge of $6/Gb thereafter.
Does the exemption from the excess $6/gb charge from 1 April apply to my INC2SLA plan too?

It would be great if you could be shape me down to 512 kbps, instead of charging me $6/Gb!

Thanks!
Change to the new plans.

BTW, as Forumadmin said before, this only affects less than 1,000 customers.

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 5:06 pm
by jmurty
I don't really care whether you shape or charge for excess use. I accept that the management of this (and associated cost) is my problem.

What I'd really like you to do is change the policy of blacklisting the connection until the user clicks on the captured portal form accepting the additional charge or agreement to only download another 2 GB.

I run a mail server along with web services from my connection and on a couple of occasions in the last 2 years I've hit my cap and had my connection cut off for some hours before I could get home to click on the form.

By all means SMS me or send and email to notify me that I'm approaching the cap but please don't cut off my connection.

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 5:17 pm
by Old Flame
They look good! Is there going to be an option to change to them plans anytime soon for existing users in their members area? Edit: Please ignore that, I just noticed they are there :oops: I take it there is now more Peak data to get used up which prompted the changes. Either way the plans look like awesome value :D Slight confusion with the Z/20NOTEL when applying to change:

When in members area it says Peak Zero/$1.00 per gb used OffPeak Zero/$0.50 per gb used

When clicking apply it says Peak 10 gbytes Offpeak No Charge

In fact all of them when clicking apply say no charge instead of Unlimited like they say before clicking apply. I will wait till this is sorted before applying. And I take it the backdated to 1st April means they will be effective immediately rather than waiting till next month.. Sorry about the 100 questions.

Re: ADSL2 Plan Changes

Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 5:18 pm
by machine
Content deleted.

Breaks forum rules.