more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Connection issues, drop outs or speed related faults for ADSL and ADSL2+ services
Post Reply
oldfart1
Posts: 25
Joined: Sat May 30, 2009 2:08 pm
Location: melbourne

more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by oldfart1 » Sun Jun 14, 2009 10:58 pm

Like madbunny I'm puzzled, and i've read the other threads. I can't imagine what complex anything could be hindering the process. I've had this phone/landline for 30 years; no fax, nothing but phone and 512/128 adsl1 with aanet for last 4years. AAnet use telstra infrastructure, as do aapt who rent me the line ( I know the wholesaler ref num), so I shouldn't have to drop my isp early as some others have had to do; in fact exetel said not to before churn date. aanet support rapid transfer.
I've emailed the appropriate questions (I think) to telstra via aapt re any other functions active on my line, but no idea how long that will take, and a second to aanet to confirm there are no issues there.
What else to do?
I'm wondering if there would be a technical advantage in switching to telstra home budget so as to remove aapt as a potential tech problem (21 day min turnaround), or churning from aanet adsl1 to exetel adsl1 as an interim step to a move to adsl2 plan later (but would either of these moves get rid of or sidestep the 'complex' rejection problem, ie, am i still going to get a 'complex' rejection even with the adsl1 churn?).
I thought this was going to be a simple exercise. Your comments appreciated.

CoreyPlover
Volunteer Site Admin
Posts: 5922
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 2:24 pm
Location: Melbourne, VIC

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by CoreyPlover » Mon Jun 15, 2009 12:01 pm

oldfart1 wrote:I'm wondering if there would be a technical advantage in switching to telstra home budget so as to remove aapt as a potential tech problem (21 day min turnaround)
This would probably not work. The "complex services" refers to the ADSL codes that are present on your line and is not related to the AAPT/Telstra owned phone line.
oldfart1 wrote:or churning from aanet adsl1 to exetel adsl1 as an interim step to a move to adsl2 plan later
You would incur an early termination fee if you did this and upgraded to ADSL2+ before 6 months though. But you would probably need to do this in conjunction with a port to a Telstra phone line, ready for when you upgrade Exetel ADSL1->ADSL2+. You shouldn't get a complex rejection though as the transfer will be processed as a "churn" and so expects ADSL codes to be present.

Easiest process in my mind: befriend a neighbour with wireless internet to use in the interim, reestablish a Telstra based phone line dropping the ADSL codes and then apply as a new customer.

oldfart1
Posts: 25
Joined: Sat May 30, 2009 2:08 pm
Location: melbourne

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by oldfart1 » Mon Jun 15, 2009 2:59 pm

1. [[The "complex services" refers to the ADSL codes that are present on your line and is not related to the AAPT/Telstra owned phone line.]]
Corey, are u saying it doesn't matter whether my adsl1 is on telstra infrastructure or not? This doesn't seem to gel with other exetel info ; quote from 'Thank you" email:- 4) Exetel can only port-in telephone numbers (with the DSL2 bundle) that are:
- portable; and
- are on Telstra equipment"
uh, oh; Perhaps you need to explain for me what "portable" means in telephony context.
I can say that when I made an inquiry to telstra re 'budget line' switch, I was told that my phone line is "unported", but no other details could be released. What does that mean in reality, in terms of this present discussion?

2. [[But you would probably need to do this in conjunction with a port to a Telstra phone line, ready for when you upgrade Exetel ADSL1->ADSL2+]]
Are you saying that although I am on telstra infrastructure(aapt and aanet), my line is not ported to telstra, which it needs to be for churn adsl1 to adsl1 at exetel, or needs to be ported to telstra for churn exetel adsl1 to adsl2?

3. [[You shouldn't get a complex rejection though as the transfer will be processed as a "churn" and so expects ADSL codes to be present]]
If aanet supports rapid transfer (isn't that churn? ), why doesn't the above rule apply in that case?

Thanks again. (sorry i don't know how to put text in boxes)

CoreyPlover
Volunteer Site Admin
Posts: 5922
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 2:24 pm
Location: Melbourne, VIC

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by CoreyPlover » Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:41 pm

oldfart1 wrote:Corey, are u saying it doesn't matter whether my adsl1 is on telstra infrastructure or not? This doesn't seem to gel with other exetel info ; quote from 'Thank you" email:- 4) Exetel can only port-in telephone numbers (with the DSL2 bundle) that are:
- portable; and
- are on Telstra equipment"
uh, oh; Perhaps you need to explain for me what "portable" means in telephony context.
I can say that when I made an inquiry to telstra re 'budget line' switch, I was told that my phone line is "unported", but no other details could be released. What does that mean in reality, in terms of this present discussion?
If ADSL1 is on Telstra infrastructure, then it should be transferrable to ADSL2+. But usually, TPG, iiNet, etc ADSL1 services are provided on their own infrastructure and hence they get rejected when a transfer is attempted. You state that yours in via aaNet but on Telstra infrastructure so it is beyond my technical understanding exactly how this affects things.

However, as you mention that your number is "non-portable" this may explain things. Portable / Non portable refers to whether a Telstra phone number can be shifted between carriers. A small proportion of old numbers (and your is very old) are configured in ways which don't allow Exetel/Optus to take control of your line and therefore won't allow you to apply for Bundled or Naked ADSL2+ on that number. If you want these services, you probably need to ask Telstra to assign you a new (portable) number but I'll admit, this is again exceeding my technical understanding. See http://forum.exetel.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=284&t=32178 and http://forum.exetel.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=230&t=23651 for similar threads.
oldfart1 wrote:2. [[But you would probably need to do this in conjunction with a port to a Telstra phone line, ready for when you upgrade Exetel ADSL1->ADSL2+]]
Are you saying that although I am on telstra infrastructure(aapt and aanet), my line is not ported to telstra, which it needs to be for churn adsl1 to adsl1 at exetel, or needs to be ported to telstra for churn exetel adsl1 to adsl2?
Well, I'm saying that a Telstra phone line leased through aaNet may be considered different to a straight Telstra phone line when it come to moving an Exetel ADSL1 service to an Exetel ADSL2+ service. For the Third party ADSL1 to Exetel ADSL1 churn, I wouldn't think it would matter so much. But given the above statement about phone line portability, I'd say you have bigger issues
oldfart1 wrote:3. [[You shouldn't get a complex rejection though as the transfer will be processed as a "churn" and so expects ADSL codes to be present]]
If aanet supports rapid transfer (isn't that churn? ), why doesn't the above rule apply in that case?
I think any ADSL1 -> ADSL1 churn will be OK but I think that it may be an issue for any future Exetel ADSL1 -> Exetel ADSL2+ transfer

You can either try to email provisioning@exetel.com.au to see if they can shed light on the technical reason for the rejection and a preferred transfer path going forward, or you can try phoning support to speak to someone in sales (although I'll admit, these are fairly technical issue and the sales operators may or may not be able to help you directly) or you can try your luck with Telstra to see whether your phone line is, indeed, unportable and whether Telstra can assign you a new number that is portable.

oldfart1
Posts: 25
Joined: Sat May 30, 2009 2:08 pm
Location: melbourne

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by oldfart1 » Mon Jun 15, 2009 8:35 pm

Phew! I'm sinking fast, and I'm reasonably technical.
One quick correction though, which may throw a different angle on your response re portability. What I said was that telstra said my line was "unported", not unportable. What does unported mean?
I'll think I'll wait and see what aapt can get out of telstra on 'other functions', then pursue your 2 suggestions, viz, contact provisioning, and then subject to that outcome, contact telstra as per your last suggestion.
Thanks again Corey for the detailed response.

CoreyPlover
Volunteer Site Admin
Posts: 5922
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 2:24 pm
Location: Melbourne, VIC

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by CoreyPlover » Mon Jun 15, 2009 11:10 pm

oldfart1 wrote:What I said was that telstra said my line was "unported", not unportable. What does unported mean?
I can't think of any definition for that term that makes sense in the current context. I agree that you should follow up with AAPT, then with provisioning@exetel.com.au.

Good luck

oldfart1
Posts: 25
Joined: Sat May 30, 2009 2:08 pm
Location: melbourne

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by oldfart1 » Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:34 pm

Corey. More info. It seems I'm NOT connected via telstra dslam at all. Although aanet do use telstra dslams, unfortunately, it seems, my adsl service is via NEXTEP, apparently a divn of NEC. I expect this explains the rejection. Not sure of best next move. Will ask aanet if they can move it to a telstra dslam, but that seems unlikely.
Is it the same activation cost whether i switch or start fresh?

CoreyPlover
Volunteer Site Admin
Posts: 5922
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 2:24 pm
Location: Melbourne, VIC

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by CoreyPlover » Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:45 pm

oldfart1 wrote:Is it the same activation cost whether i switch or start fresh?
Same costs charged by Exetel for ADSL2+ activation, yes. But "starting fresh" would necessarily involve cancelling the service, incurring downtime, and having to pay Telstra at least $59 to re-activate your phone service before you can apply as a new Exetel ADSL2+ customer.

The non-Telstra DSLAM is probably going to prevent any upgrade path, even Exetel ADSL1 -> Exetel ADSL2+, so I do think you are left with cancellation, reactivation of a standard Telstra line and reapplying as a new customer. Perhaps you can ask Telstra before canceling your existing services and they might be able to take over the line, porting your current phone number across from AAPT

oldfart1
Posts: 25
Joined: Sat May 30, 2009 2:08 pm
Location: melbourne

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by oldfart1 » Tue Jun 16, 2009 6:11 pm

I've just had a thought on portability. If I used to be billed by Telstra, then I switched to a AAPT home-phone plan for the last 5years or so, wouldn't that mean that my number was portable? and that it could just as easily be re-ported to Optus/exetel? or re-ported back to telstra if for example I went to 'home budget' ?
BTW, at this stage we don't even know if portability is an issue, I guess. I'll have to try my luck with a query to telstra again, but judging by comment in other threads about in-house telstra knowledge on the topic of portability, I won't hold my breath.

CoreyPlover
Volunteer Site Admin
Posts: 5922
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 2:24 pm
Location: Melbourne, VIC

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by CoreyPlover » Tue Jun 16, 2009 9:20 pm

oldfart1 wrote:I've just had a thought on portability. If I used to be billed by Telstra, then I switched to a AAPT home-phone plan for the last 5years or so, wouldn't that mean that my number was portable? and that it could just as easily be re-ported to Optus/exetel? or re-ported back to telstra if for example I went to 'home budget' ?
Since you are on a non-Telstra DSLAM at the moment, yes I would agree.
oldfart1 wrote:BTW, at this stage we don't even know if portability is an issue, I guess.
Very true. Non-portability only affects a very small percentage of services and your issues could conceivably be explained by the non-Telstra DSLAM.

nucari
Posts: 19
Joined: Mon Apr 27, 2009 4:46 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by nucari » Thu Jun 18, 2009 12:11 pm

It seems like you are having a similar problem to me although I only want to transfer my internet conenction to an Exetel Powertel ADSL2 service.

See thread here: http://forum.exetel.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=284&t=32371

Have you been able to resolve your issue yet?

I've been trying to transfer over to Exetel ADSL2 from Internode ADSL1. I was told that my ADSL1 was provided via Telstra infrastructure and Internode participate in SSS transfers. So it's been strange as to why my application was rejected. Maybe it's the same problem as yours and my ADSL1 connection is actually not on Telstra infrastructure.
oldfart1 wrote:Although aanet do use telstra dslams, unfortunately, it seems, my adsl service is via NEXTEP, apparently a divn of NEC.
How did you find out that your ADSL1 connection was via NEXTP?

CoreyPlover
Volunteer Site Admin
Posts: 5922
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 2:24 pm
Location: Melbourne, VIC

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by CoreyPlover » Thu Jun 18, 2009 12:16 pm

nucari wrote:So it's been strange as to why my application was rejected
Possibly the same reasons as why you can't transfer from an Exetel ADSL2+ PTL service to an Exetel ADSL2+ INCDSL service: One is provided via SSS and the other via ULL. Provisioning at Exetel can go from ULL to SSS without downtime, but not from SSS to ULL; this requires outright cancellation of the service and reapplication.

As for oldfart1, it would be best to email provisioning@exetel.com.au and ask them for your options for transferring. (Edit: I see you've already been in touch with Jason and provisioning@exetel.com.au) Cancellation of existing service and reapplication is definitely one of them, but if money is no object then there might be an alternative way for you to port to Exetel ADSL1 first, then either waiting 6 months or pay the cancellation fee instantly and go to ADSL2+. Alternatively (and what I think is best) is to invest in a HSPA connection that you can use in the interim downtime

oldfart1
Posts: 25
Joined: Sat May 30, 2009 2:08 pm
Location: melbourne

Re: more adsl1 to adsl2 rejection queries

Post by oldfart1 » Thu Jun 18, 2009 2:54 pm

nucari wrote:- [How did you find out that your ADSL1 connection was via NEXTP?]

I started to track down the links in the chain, and not rely on the website info. A call to tech support gave me that info. My a/c details show 'telstra infrastructure', but not so as it turns out.

Post Reply