Change to AUP - Section (d)

Open discussion regarding technological or telecommunication issues
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Tazz
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by Tazz » Tue Nov 17, 2009 3:53 pm

CoreyPlover wrote:Exetel may wish to consider a scheme similar to some cable providers (I remember Optus Cable doing this many years ago): Assign users a category as based on ratio of their rolling 30 day downloads to the Exetel-wide rolling 30 days downloads. Something like green for a ratio of 0 to 1, orange for 1 to 2, red for 2 to 3 and black for 3+. Display this (colour and value) to the user in the user facilities in place of the actual GB value.

The reasoning is that if you try to present a GB value, people will try to target it in absolute terms. But this will be their own undoing as a daily GB target is subject to volatility. If, instead, you display a colour coded category and a ratio, then if users see themselves verging up past the red category and towards the black, they can just stop downloading. If you curb your downloads your ratio is guaranteed (mathematically) to decrease, therefore you can regulate yourself in order to keep below the black listed category.
No please, don't make more changes!
The new system of having "Uncharged Plan Maximum Off Peak Download 79.5 gbytes" has only just been put in place!

CoreyPlover
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by CoreyPlover » Tue Nov 17, 2009 4:14 pm

I truly struggle to think of why people are so worried. How is this for all those scaremongers on the NF/21 plan: Limit your own downloads to 60GB. Problem solved.

Think about it. If you all just ignore the whole 3 x average and limit your own downloads to 60GB, then you won't get booted (because even if the average usage falls to 20GB I doubt Exetel are going to enforce the 3 x average policy when it falls under 60GB). By voluntarily doing this you are all getting exactly what you desire as it effectively returns you to the previous off-peak quota basis.

All this speculation about how the average quota will decrease is nonsense. ForumAdmin stated that every month in the past has shown steady increases in average off-peak usage. I strong doubt that this trend will be reversed because of people worrying about the new AUP and even if they do start worrying, this will be more than offset by anti-selection as the "uncharged" off-peak will attract new high usage downloaders.

Col
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by Col » Tue Nov 17, 2009 4:16 pm

cdonges wrote:But know this, I will eat all the eggs I have paid for!
Well last month you got 60 eggs. This month is a freebie, but the general idea is around 79 eggs. I'm happy if it stays around that.

Col
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by Col » Tue Nov 17, 2009 4:19 pm

CoreyPlover wrote:the "uncharged" off-peak will attract new high usage downloaders.
The AUP might scare them off though, especially if the limit is hidden in the user facilities where only current users see it (unless they really go looking if it is stated somewhere).

john.d
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by john.d » Tue Nov 17, 2009 4:30 pm

Col wrote:
john.d wrote:-The punishment/penalty is too harsh..
Perhaps. Exetel has every right to terminate the relationship with a customer, especially if they are abusive, though from the outside it does look a bit extreme. Don't get me wrong, abusers need to be punished. My idea would be to reduce their offpeak period for 1-2 months to say 3am to 9am as punishment, moving the rampant downloading into the quietest part of offpeak.

I'm a little worried about the average decreasing too, however I'm confident that the bulk of the customer base will continue increasing their average, like they have been doing over the years, and keep it stable and slowly increase it over time. I will wait and see how the system goes over the next couple of months before I give a final verdict.
-abuse of the system? But it was exetel that open the gates by making it unmeter/uncharge, ppl are merely doing what is with their terms.
If you are going to make it uncharged/unlimited, then what do you expect.
-No, the average would decrease because ppl would go below the average cos of fear..thus the average would decrease each month
-Some months might have drop in the average which would mean less value
-No why reduce the offpeak as punishment, why not just go back to the old 60gb system, nice simple for everyone.
-the penalty is simply getting charged with $$ vs getting boot off.

This new system will definitely suck..cos of the points I made in the first post..

john.d
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by john.d » Tue Nov 17, 2009 4:37 pm

CoreyPlover wrote:I truly struggle to think of why people are so worried. How is this for all those scaremongers on the NF/21 plan: Limit your own downloads to 60GB. Problem solved.

Think about it. If you all just ignore the whole 3 x average and limit your own downloads to 60GB, then you won't get booted (because even if the average usage falls to 20GB I doubt Exetel are going to enforce the 3 x average policy when it falls under 60GB). By voluntarily doing this you are all getting exactly what you desire as it effectively returns you to the previous off-peak quota basis.

All this speculation about how the average quota will decrease is nonsense. ForumAdmin stated that every month in the past has shown steady increases in average off-peak usage. I strong doubt that this trend will be reversed because of people worrying about the new AUP and even if they do start worrying, this will be more than offset by anti-selection as the "uncharged" off-peak will attract new high usage downloaders.
If 60gb fine, then put it back to the old system..
This system is not the same, cos you get booted..
The old system means you get 2gb buffer then get charged $6 or $3.
Plus there is a fear factor in this system..

By making it 3x average only complicates things for many ppl.
And also unexpected average changes each month..
And the fear aspect would reduce the average..
And now suggesting a ratio thing would even complicate it further..

Why not use the old KISS rule..

Col
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by Col » Tue Nov 17, 2009 4:42 pm

john.d wrote:Why not use the old KISS rule..
You can't try to be innovative if you stick to that rule. I am willing to give Exetel the benefit of the doubt and, as I said earlier, will wait a couple of months before saying the policy should be thrown out.

rx213b
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by rx213b » Tue Nov 17, 2009 4:51 pm

Dare I actually interpret the true meaning of this change to saying this:

'we are changing the plans so someone on the 12gb peak plan can't download 180gb off peak and get away with it'

Now, they will be asked to move to a higher peak plan so they pay their way instead of being a 'bandwidth hog'
Last edited by rx213b on Tue Nov 17, 2009 5:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

brod
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by brod » Tue Nov 17, 2009 4:52 pm

john.d wrote: -No, the average would decrease because ppl would go below the average cos of fear..thus the average would decrease each month
If the average is 26.5GB, then the service cutoff point is 79.5GB. This means there is no reason whatsoever for people to stay under 26.5GB. If you want to be 100% safe, all you need to do is stay 5GB under the maximum ie. 74.5GB

john.d
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by john.d » Tue Nov 17, 2009 4:59 pm

brod wrote:
john.d wrote: -No, the average would decrease because ppl would go below the average cos of fear..thus the average would decrease each month
If the average is 26.5GB, then the service cutoff point is 79.5GB. This means there is no reason whatsoever for people to stay under 26.5GB. If you want to be 100% safe, all you need to do is stay 5GB under the maximum ie. 74.5GB
If ppl download 74.5gb etc.. then next month average would be like 20-23gb etc.. cos adding the 74.5 would mean less..
So next month the max limt would be 60-70gb..etc.. then ppl would download say 65gb limit..

Thus the average would decrease each month..

cdonges
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by cdonges » Tue Nov 17, 2009 5:06 pm

john.d wrote:If ppl download 74.5gb etc.. then next month average would be like 20-23gb etc.. cos adding the 74.5 would mean less..
So next month the max limt would be 60-70gb..etc.. then ppl would download say 65gb limit..
If everyone downladed 74.5GB then the average next month would be 74.5GB and the total you could download without a kicking would be 223.5GB (74.5 x 3)!

Obviously everyone won't download that but I think the average will increase each month rather than decrease.

People that use the downloads to just under the limit will help lift the average for everyone. I think they should be called heroes! :)

john.d
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by john.d » Tue Nov 17, 2009 5:13 pm

I doubt exetel would let the limit 220gb etc..

plus it would be very hard to for many ppl to get that much data on a adsl1 connection..

john.d
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by john.d » Tue Nov 17, 2009 5:16 pm

cdonges wrote:
john.d wrote:If ppl download 74.5gb etc.. then next month average would be like 20-23gb etc.. cos adding the 74.5 would mean less..
So next month the max limt would be 60-70gb..etc.. then ppl would download say 65gb limit..
If everyone downladed 74.5GB then the average next month would be 74.5GB and the total you could download without a kicking would be 223.5GB (74.5 x 3)!

Obviously everyone won't download that but I think the average will increase each month rather than decrease.

People that use the downloads to just under the limit will help lift the average for everyone. I think they should be called heroes! :)
That's the thing it has been unmetered for 1 month now, and the limit was only 79.5gb, which means the average was 26.5gb..

I don't see how everyone would suddenly download 74.5gb average and push it up to 223gb..

if anything, ppl would download less than the average cos of the termination fear.

rahul
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by rahul » Tue Nov 17, 2009 5:32 pm

If 26.5gig was avg for the month of oct, that is only based on 60gb limit. This month how ever had no limit and as a result the avg should be considerably higher. Lets say 30gb was the avg for nov, thus giving a limit of 90GB, and if the heavy down-loaders reach the 90gb (as oppose to 60gig in oct), this will bring the avg up again, to say 35GB, thus limit would be 115gb... and so on....

But of cours, for this to happen you will need to rely on users who always reach the 3x limit.

Ignoring the month of nov and dec.... here is a scenario for the year 2010that could happen.

Jan: Avg - 30GB = max limit 90GB.
Feb: Avg - 32.5GB = 97.5GB
Mar: Avg - 35GB = 115GB
April: Avg - 37.5GB = 112.5GB
etc.....

Depending on the number max down loaders their are, the Avg could actually rise exponentially. Basically the so called abusers will become the heroes for many.

Tazz
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Re: Change to AUP - Section (d)

Post by Tazz » Tue Nov 17, 2009 5:40 pm

I don't know why everyone is so worried about the average dropping.
This is the bandwidth usage for the past 12 months...
Image
It has about doubled, as it has each year since Exetel started, I see no reason to think it won't continue to rise as even more people start using things like ABC iView and Foxtel downloads and catching up with watching TV programs on the networks streaming sites etc etc etc

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