Off Peak Periods

Discussions regarding new & existing plans and other Exetel initiatives
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frotac1
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2010 8:21 pm
Location: sydney

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by frotac1 » Fri Nov 12, 2010 2:44 pm

CoreyPlover wrote:
maestro wrote:Also, I don't understand why people are complaining that the off-peak times are not convenient for them. I see the off-peak period as being governed by usage patterns (we get off-peak when there is low usage) and it is "cheap" (high quota allowance) because it is undesirable. Off-peak then becomes useful to users who can automate downloads to take advantage of that low usage period and becomes an incentive to change usage patterns to "spread the load".
This is the *exact* intention of off-peak. If only more people reasoned as perfectly as you
maestro wrote:Also, an important item in this discussion... Does Exetel pay for bytes transferred, or for available bandwidth on their uplinks (or a combination of both). If the charge is purely for available bandwidth, then there is definitely a good reason to want to flatten the bandwidth trend.
Correct: available bandwidth. They provision a total bandwidth that is enough to ensure there is no (or very little) contention on Exetel's network during peak, and then try whatever incentives they can to fill the resulting gaps in the underutilised periods to get the most bang for their buck
I agree with this totally, also for those who say my computer is too old and dont have hibernate, you can set your computer to turn on automatically in the bios! For instance say offpeak starts at 4am, set your computer to turn on at 3:55am and set your download manager to start downloading at 4am simple!
I think people just think that the offpeak is a right for them, yet exetel gives you such a large quota in offpeak as a gift at a time that has least impact on everyone else on the server! They have done so for quite some time now! If you want to download more stuff in the month at your convenience, simply upgrade your monthly package to one that has a larger peak allowance!

d5.lam
Posts: 44
Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 9:21 pm
Location: brisbane

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by d5.lam » Sat Nov 13, 2010 5:19 pm

frotac1 wrote:also for those who say my computer is too old and dont have hibernate, you can set your computer to turn on automatically in the bios
yeah if it lets you! lol., only some allow it/have it. on all my laptops sofar none can do this. It's pretty tightly locked down unfortunately. else it would be peace of cake and i would probably use 200gb offpeak a month instead of 90 :P

ronald
Posts: 65
Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2006 11:36 am
Location: Melbourne

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by ronald » Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:39 pm

Personally, I am not too happy with the current peak/off-peak rules.

I'd say my downloads overall are in the "low to moderate" bracket, and to me it is more important to have access to some additional quota at reasonable times, than for the off-peak quota to be particularly big. I used to use it for downloads that are out of the ordinary (like recently an SDK) or for Software Updates, or to spend some time on youTube without constantly watching my quota.

So I don't care whether the off-peak quota is 20GB or 50GB or 100GB or unlimited, but I do care about it being available to me at a time when I am likely, or can easily organise, to be at my computer. Usually that's not the case at or after 2am, and also not early enough before 8am that off-peak would be of any practical use to me. When off-peak started at midnight, I could just start Software Update then and go to sleep. As it is now, I can choose whether to take a hit on my on-peak quota or stay up into the night in order to avoid that. I have recently had to download updates for a software that I just installed, which took 600MB out of my quota, or the equivalent of two days of average use. Now there are system updates that have been waiting for two days now because of that conundrum - it would be another close to 600MB and I have not even caught up with my previous splurge. I don't like it one bit.

I'm on a naked ADSL2+ 10GB/month plan now, having over time (a bit over four years now) migrated from a 512KB/s 4GB plan at the same cost (or rather now plus the new "admin fee"). Obviously the speed is better value, as is VoIP versus Telstra, however for my usage pattern the download volume, which this discussion is about, is not. The 4GB were between 12pm and 12am, and then I had 30GB to burn between 12am and 12pm. Which I never even came close to doing, and there may have been one or two months when I came up against the 4GB limit. If we assume (for me) useful working hours from 9am to 1am, that gives me 12 hours to use my peak quota, and four hours of what for my purposes is identical with unmetered access, plus the opportunity to start larger downloads before going to bed. Now I have 10GB, full stop. Unless I want to get up in the middle of the night, which I don't particularly like doing.

My impression with all the changes up and down over the years is that Exetel tries to accommodate their high-bandwidth users whenever an opportunity arises, and then has to scale back when it finds that that clientele uses the upgraded facilities to the max. My observation is that any upgrades I have seen were always helping the leechers and not doing much for the "normal" user, and the limitations that followed impacted on both, but more the normal users. Example is the constant increase in off-peak quota (which I, for one, don't care about one bit) and the limiting of the time slot when it is offered (which I care about a lot). I think Exetel needs to ask the question which customers it wants to cater for, and define their plans accordingly.

If you offer - I don' t even know what the current limit is, 180GB? - of off-peak quota, then the leechers will set their downloaders to whatever the start time is and suck whatever you give them in the available time, saturating the available bandwidth. If that's the clientele you want to serve, then just keep doing what you're doing. If you want more "normal" and casual users who just do what they're doing and want to have some opportunity to occasionally watch some video or handle bigger downloads, that strategy won't work as well, if at all. Maybe you want to maintain separate plans for either clientele, maybe you want to have variations in your plans, or maybe you just need to make a conscious decision on who your preferred customers are and cater to them. If you haven't already done so, but my impression is that your idea of the "perfect customer" is not quite as clearly defined as it could be (apart from regularly paying their bills and stuff like that).

Personally, I'd be happy to have an off-peak quota of, say, twice to thrice the peak quota, but at times other than the middle of the night. If 12-16h is a slow time for you right now as it seems from the graph, I'd be happy to take that, too, though it would be good to have at least part of the time in the evening. Obviously a lower download allowance will average to a smaller impact on your bandwidth graph. Of course there may still be big fluctuations over the month, with some users using most of their quota as soon as they can, but it's clear that bandwidth usage is not just determined by how many users are downloading at any particular time, but also on their individual bandwidths and, effectively, quotas. I don't know how hard it would be to make either the bandwidth, or the off-peak time boundaries, or both, quota-dependent (or in other words the quota dependent on the desired bandwidth and off-peak times). Give someone more quota if they agree to be throttled to accommodate the current network load (wasn't there something like that some time ago?). Or give them more off-peak hours in exchange for a lower quota. Or any combination thereof. As I said, 10GB on peak and 20GB off-peak (or 30, like in 2006, at similar times, as in 12-12, or even 12-10) would suit my needs most of the time, and where it does not I'll be happy to accept the trade-offs (inconvenient times, lower speeds, extra payment, whatever).

It has been said that off-peak times are scheduled to coincide with times of lower load to better balance resource usage and of course that makes sense. What should also be obvious, of course, is that the whole game shifts along with any change in off-peak hours. The leechers will follow you anywhere, the normal users won't. So if you just move the general off-peak slot to 12-16h, without any other changes, you'll probably find that to be your busiest time very soon.

Anyway, just my $0.02.

P.S.: Not directly to the topic at hand, but to that of how such changes are introduced: that I was put into the situation where I had to choose between either paying $5/month more for my plan or $10 to change to the worse off-peak hours (but more quota), with the only other option being to leave Exetel for another provider (at no cost), annoyed me quite a bit. Upon my request and pointing this out, Exetel graciously waived the changing fee, but nonetheless later slapped on the $3 "admin fee", so I might well have been better off with my existing plan that was made more expensive. I feel that I am not part of the problem you are trying to address with these measures, so that adds to my perception that they hit the wrong people.

P.P.S.: And now I'm really annoyed as your forum software asked me to login again and subsequently threw away all I had written. (I already had logged in first with my forum user name and was then required to login with my customer details.) So this is an earlier copy. I can't be bothered to re-edit the whole thing, so please excuse any inconsistencies and repetitions. The final version was better but there you go.

snudge42
Posts: 21
Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2008 4:17 pm
Location: Australia

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by snudge42 » Sun Nov 14, 2010 11:47 am

I am unhappy with my current off peak period.

When I first signed up I had 12am-12pm. Then one day I must have 'blinked' because I was cut back to 2am-12pm whereas others who had 'opted in' to a shifted peak period of 2am-2pm or something like this retained their 12 hours off peak. 10 hours off peak was not so bad, and my morning usage was metered as off peak, so I didn't complain.

I recently changed to a different plan which I was sure had the same offpeak hours, but I'm now churning through my peak quota very fast - so I checked and found out I now have 2am-8am as my off peak. This is pretty lame. I've gone from 12gb peak to 10gb peak, but now most of the day is peak, so it's getting pretty damn tight.

I really want my 2am-12pm period back. Even 2am-10am would be better. It'd be nice if users could choose any 8/10 hour period between 10pm and 2pm. That'd spread the load nicely.

Cheers,

Sebastian

The Land of Smeg
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2010 4:14 pm
Location: EWOD, VIC

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by The Land of Smeg » Mon Nov 15, 2010 6:50 pm

I would also like to add now that most who have replied want different off-peak slots to choose from, the slots should have different incentives to keep the leachers away from Late Evening and Late Morning times when Low-Medium users will want to take advantage of Off-Peak.

eg: If you choose a slot which includes 10PM or 8AM, the off-peak quota is only 1:1 to the on-peak quota (eg: 10GB/10GB). If you choose slots between 12AM-6AM - you get 1:18 (eg: 10GB/180GB).

Franpa
Posts: 438
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:44 am
Location: Australia, QLD

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by Franpa » Mon Nov 15, 2010 8:16 pm

The Land of Smeg wrote:I would also like to add now that most who have replied want different off-peak slots to choose from, the slots should have different incentives to keep the leachers away from Late Evening and Late Morning times when Low-Medium users will want to take advantage of Off-Peak.

eg: If you choose a slot which includes 10PM or 8AM, the off-peak quota is only 1:1 to the on-peak quota (eg: 10GB/10GB). If you choose slots between 12AM-6AM - you get 1:18 (eg: 10GB/180GB).
The most who have replied aren't the majority.
Windows 10 Pro x64 | Intel i7 920 @ 3.6GHz | ASUS P6T Motherboard | 24GB DDR3 1520MHz RAM | MSI Gamer 1070Ti 8GB | Integrated Sound Card | Corsair AX760 Platinum Power Supply | Exetel ZTE H268 Modem

Lawrie
Posts: 313
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Location: Unanderra

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by Lawrie » Tue Nov 16, 2010 9:54 am

The problem was that until recently, when making a change to your paln from the Members Facilities, it was not obvious that the new plans had different peak/offpeak times.
This issue was discussed in this forum and eventually was rectified so that the peak/offpeak times for the new plans are clearly labeled with the other data about the plans.

ronald
Posts: 65
Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2006 11:36 am
Location: Melbourne

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by ronald » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:59 pm

Lawrie wrote:The problem was that until recently, when making a change to your paln from the Members Facilities, it was not obvious that the new plans had different peak/offpeak times.
This issue was discussed in this forum and eventually was rectified so that the peak/offpeak times for the new plans are clearly labeled with the other data about the plans.
Yes, that was a problem that caught me out, too. Had I realised at the time that the plan I was changing to had the off-peak hours it does, I would have thought twice about doing it. Good to see that this has been tended to. Looking forward to perhaps being offered other options, soon.

Cheers,

Ronald

ForumAdmin
Posts: 3663
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2004 2:31 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by ForumAdmin » Thu Nov 18, 2010 10:58 am

Having considered the suggestions made in this thread Exetel will consider all of the options recommended and then make some preliminary decisions by the end of this month to come in to effect from December 1st.

Thank you to all of you who offered advice and suggestions.

It was very useful.

tmodel
Posts: 8
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:37 pm
Location: Terrigal

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by tmodel » Fri Nov 19, 2010 9:17 pm

Hi
Simply offer a variety of off peak times within each plan that best suit Exetel

Col
Posts: 213
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2008 7:55 pm
Location: NSW

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by Col » Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:18 pm

ForumAdmin wrote:Having considered the suggestions made in this thread Exetel will consider all of the options recommended and then make some preliminary decisions by the end of this month to come in to effect from December 1st.
So the off peak period is definitely going to be extended this time? Are all service types (ADSL1 and the several ADSL2+ products) going to be getting this change?

CoreyPlover
Volunteer Site Admin
Posts: 5922
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 2:24 pm
Location: Melbourne, VIC

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by CoreyPlover » Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:26 pm

Col wrote:
ForumAdmin wrote:Having considered the suggestions made in this thread Exetel will consider all of the options recommended and then make some preliminary decisions by the end of this month to come in to effect from December 1st.
So the off peak period is definitely going to be extended this time? Are all service types (ADSL1 and the several ADSL2+ products) going to be getting this change?
!!? Where'd it say that Exetel would extend times? ForumAdmin said that "Exetel will consider its options"
I am a volunteer moderator and not an Exetel staff member. As with all forum posts, mine do not constitute any "official" Exetel position. Support tickets may be logged via https://helpdesk.exetel.com.au or residentialsupport@exetel.com.au

Col
Posts: 213
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2008 7:55 pm
Location: NSW

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by Col » Thu Nov 25, 2010 2:23 pm

CoreyPlover wrote:
Col wrote:
ForumAdmin wrote:Having considered the suggestions made in this thread Exetel will consider all of the options recommended and then make some preliminary decisions by the end of this month to come in to effect from December 1st.
So the off peak period is definitely going to be extended this time? Are all service types (ADSL1 and the several ADSL2+ products) going to be getting this change?
!!? Where'd it say that Exetel would extend times? ForumAdmin said that "Exetel will consider its options"
In the opening post of this thread FA said: "There may now be some scope for re-looking at extending the 'off peak' period and we would welcome customer suggestions on how best this could be done."

I took that to mean that the hours could possibly be extended, as most of the suggestions in this thread have been along those lines (along with being able to possibly select your own time period, etc). I get my question had a limited scope (just asking about extending off peak hours) but that is all I wanted to know. My post was aimed to be just a poke to see how far this has progressed and if it would apply to the AAPT ADSL2+ plans (which I have access to). I thought it a more thoughtful post than just a "So how is this thing coming along?" yet hopefully not as annoying as asking many different questions (where in my post there are just two hopefully quick yes/no questions).
Last edited by Col on Thu Nov 25, 2010 7:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.

CoreyPlover
Volunteer Site Admin
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Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by CoreyPlover » Thu Nov 25, 2010 2:28 pm

While most of the suggestions in this thread talk of extending off-peak hours, it may not even be on Exetel's agenda. In particular, note viewtopic.php?p=283722#p283722. It might be that the "user choice" of a 6 hour window is being considered. It might even be that no change is being considered.
I am a volunteer moderator and not an Exetel staff member. As with all forum posts, mine do not constitute any "official" Exetel position. Support tickets may be logged via https://helpdesk.exetel.com.au or residentialsupport@exetel.com.au

Col
Posts: 213
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2008 7:55 pm
Location: NSW

Re: Off Peak Periods

Post by Col » Thu Nov 25, 2010 2:37 pm

CoreyPlover wrote:While most of the suggestions in this thread talk of extending off-peak hours, I would suggest you not assume that such a change will be implemented. In particular, note viewtopic.php?p=283722#p283722.
It was a question based on an assumption, but one that can simply be answered "no" to which I will go "okay". That post you linked to basically argues to keep things the way they are (have 6 hour off peaks) and I doubt Exetel would increase the quotas all that much (if at all) so that leaves things like having several time periods for customers to pick from to spread the load around. In FA's post a few posts up he says he is considering "all of the options recommended" so why can't I just simply find out if extending the hours is on the table. Is that okay with you?

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